Robert Trout (00:02.326)
Hello and welcome to the Parenting Problems Today podcast. My name is Robert Trout, the founder of parenttrainers.com and I am your host today. And today we have a special guest that is joining us after being the first guest on the podcast, Joanna Lilly, who is a therapeutic consultant is coming to talk with us again about one of our categories, which is young adults and
Being the expert I always refer to when it comes to some of the specifics, I really appreciate you coming and joining us on this episode. Today, if you’re the listener, we want to step into a conversation about the basics to recognize red flags when your young adult has usually left home.
very often at college or trade school or some scenario that they’re trying to now branch out their 18, 19, 20, and they’re attempting life on their own. For so many parents that we work with and do coaching with and training sessions for, there’s this reality check that young adults are still kids and very often they might run into scenarios that start to create a lot of conflict.
that leads into anxiety, sometimes depression, suicidality, I mean, you name it, it can happen through this, but there is kind of this process of, okay, how do we let them individuate and check in? How do we keep track of what’s normal and not normal and what should we know to look out for? So that’s what we’re gonna get into today. And what I’d like to do is pass it to you, and just kind of
start this conversation that when a family runs to us, you or us, for support, they’ve already found the problem, typically. It’s like, something went awry. But very often we get that conversation, right, where it’s like, I wish we had known this. So what comes up for you is the, you know, what did they wish they knew before they got to the point of needing our services?
Joanna Lilley (02:21.354)
Yeah, I think really there’s two things that kind of show up immediately. And these aren’t even red flags. It’s just kind of the messaging that I’m hearing from parents when they reach out to me. I think you’ll probably, this will resonate with you and what you hear first, that parents realize or kind of regret that they didn’t have the right support services in place at the start of the semester.
And now here we are, and I’m going to leave it kind of vague, right? Because I think it really can be open to interpretation. And there’s so many different ways that this can show up socially, emotionally, mentally, physically, academically for a young adult. And so, my gosh, we wish that we had pursued getting accommodations. my gosh, we wish we had set up an executive functioning coach or a psychiatrist or a therapist or
all of the above. And now here we are scrambling to try to put together these resources and we’re not sure if it’s too late. Right? Like that’s kind of this like, we might’ve dug ourselves a big enough like hole that we may not be able to help our young adult get out of. So that’s, that’s the first one that kind of pops up. The second one is just navigating.
a lot of the implications around withdrawal. So if we’re talking about college age students specifically, it is like trying to understand how to support the young adult in their own autonomy and making that decision, like what’s best for me in the moment, but also as a parent kind of helping them navigate, because there are, depending on the path that you pursue, there are consequences. And so understanding,
I mean, weighing the pros and cons of which path to take. mean, obviously that’s also dependent on every school and this is only right. The lens that I’m using is college students and you kind of, prefaced it as just somebody living outside of the home, which is a whole other conversation itself. But, I think those are kind of the two most recent and common themes that I’m being presented with when parents come to me. And then the overarching theme.
Joanna Lilley (04:37.046)
that encapsulates both of those, you’re gonna love this, right? It’s all about layers. Is parents kind of doing this one step forward, one step back, like a dance almost, like, do I help them? Do I let them figure this out on their own? Do I feel comfortable with them feeling? When do I know that this is more of an issue and I should step in and be assertive and help get my young adult connected to resources? Or when do I let them kind of stumble and fumble?
on their own. Like you said, is this normal? Is this not normal? So navigating that dance.
Robert Trout (05:06.796)
No.
Robert Trout (05:10.924)
Absolutely. I agree 1000 % with all of that. And you’re absolutely right. Like this conversation really is the opening of a can of worms because in the scenario of parents that want to support a young adult and that is like 18, 17, 18 all the way through like 30 these days. Like there’s a real recognition we talk about all the time at Parrot Trainers with families.
where, okay, that yes, he’s 23 years old physically, but mentally or neurologically, or the better word for us is developmentally, where is this person at in this process of developing life skills to move from where they are to where either they want to be or the parents want them to be? And that’s its own conversation right there.
Joanna Lilley (06:07.53)
Yeah
Robert Trout (06:08.778)
Because so often the kid isn’t even thinking about like what they want. They’re just in that phase of like a lot. I’m supposed to do something, so I’m going to go do something. There’s a lack of goal where the parents are saying, get a job, make money, retire one day like whatever the cheerleading from the culture of the family is. There’s always some story where the parents are going. I don’t understand why you’re not moving forward in life.
Joanna Lilley (06:23.148)
Yeah.
Robert Trout (06:37.236)
And the kid goes, what does forward mean? There’s so many aspects to this. But but yes, stepping into what you just brought up for us, it is a bigger conversation because it’s not just college. It’s the kids that are like, OK, the parents have been supporting them and holding their life together and compensating sometimes.
Joanna Lilley (06:40.012)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Robert Trout (07:04.14)
for learning disabilities or neurological process or autism or something, like there’s something in there. And then the parents get to the point and they call us or you and say, hey, we’d like to not live with this person forever. How do we move even just in that direction? So sometimes it’s, hey, we’d like them to get an apartment and a job and be able to have some level of self-support.
Other times it’s trade schools or college or whatever it might be. Like it’s such a big conversation. For me, I guess the biggest thing that we run into lately in this has just been the parent that shows up and goes, we thought we were done. Like they’re completely caught off guard that this individual, their young adult has started to struggle in any of the categories.
Joanna Lilley (07:50.103)
Mm.
Robert Trout (08:00.256)
And it’s that like, OK, yeah, yeah, we should have set up services, but very often, at least what we’re running into recently is we didn’t know we needed them. Like we, know, the structure of the family system and the school they went to and, you know, the family support or whatever it was, was enough to hold this person up to a functional eye. But as soon as they’re outside of all of that is where we start to see those. So I guess my question is, what are the?
I’m going to say the biggest decompositions you see the families come back later to and like, wait a minute. We had no idea that that was a problem. What are you saying?
Joanna Lilley (08:42.272)
Yeah, I think the exact scenario that you’re describing is that sometimes when we’re in it, right? When we’re in a school that’s overly supportive or accommodating, if the parent identifies themselves as type A and they do a fantastic job of managing all areas of life for their young adult, if just in general, I think there’s an overarching theme too of success, right? What does success look like?
And there’s also this idea that some, haven’t really stopped and paused and thought about what skills are necessary to be interdependent. And so if we’ve been so focused on this kind of transition after high school to that like launching point, but all those supports have focused on extracurriculars that are going to show up on the college application rather than like carry them through to experience
Identity development, passion, purpose, that kind of stuff. Parents that the second that their young adult lands on campus thinks that they are going to be able to just magically do all the things that their parent did for them. So all of this is to say, it’s really helpful to pause and look at what supports are in place right now and see if there’s an opportunity to peel back gently to give your young adult the opportunity or soon to be young adult the opportunity
to show up on their own, right? See if they can do it. This is some of that autonomy that’s needed so that they can be successful on campus. So I think going back to your question, it almost begs the call to action of stop what you’re doing right in this moment, see what supports are in place and what can you peel back a little bit to allow for your young adult to show up or…
you know, as we describe it sometimes, like the wheels fall off. Well, it’s because the wheels were literally held there by the school, the parents, the like all like overarching, you know, I’ve worked with young adults too that had executive functioning coaches or ADHD coaches or a therapist or a psychiatrist or all of the above just to carry them over the finish line. And then we think miraculously that they don’t need those supports when they go off. And it’s like, dude, it took a village.
Robert Trout (10:57.739)
Yes.
Joanna Lilley (11:08.258)
So it’s gonna continue to take a village. Once we magically turn 18 or magically graduate high school, we have to remember that if all of a sudden we just, we almost like peel back too much too soon, it just, it breeds the opportunity for the young adult to not realize how much they were supported to and how little they were actually leading their own life.
Robert Trout (11:31.798)
Yep. And that brings up an important point where the young adult wants to individuate. They want to leave the nest. There’s that developmental stage, at least that happens. Now, to be clear to anyone listening, they might become 17, 18, 19 and not be there developmentally. They may be scared or have significant anxiety to leave the nest or the home environment. And that could be OK developmentally because you have to
There has to be some level of acceptance that this person is developing at whatever rate they’re developing at. You know, and that’s where it’s like, okay, maybe they will go to college one day, but when they’re 25, right, not 18, they need that life experience in between to fill in the gap and develop work skills and social skills and the ability to trust that they can manage their own schedule maybe or whatever it might be.
It really is that like, okay, take a step back as the parent and recognize that just because you left home at 17, went to college, got your degree, et cetera, that’s not a repetitive story. It’s not the way it has to be done. Now, culturally, we do get pushback on that a lot, right? And especially the older, like, generations, they have this idea.
Joanna Lilley (12:42.466)
Mm-hmm.
Joanna Lilley (12:50.465)
Yeah.
Robert Trout (12:56.768)
that’s embedded, it’s gotta be this way. It’s supposed to be this way. So there’s this like, okay, if we’re gonna talk about the work or the solution for the parent, it’s really for us very often oriented in that let’s break your story, get rid of the story, and let’s make a plan. Because the story is gonna create friction and anxiety for the parents and sometimes shame for the parents because they think they failed.
Joanna Lilley (13:01.12)
Mm-hmm.
Joanna Lilley (13:23.936)
Mm-hmm.
Robert Trout (13:26.828)
There’s so much that comes up in all of this that needs to be kind of broken apart and said, okay, if we can get rid of the story of what it was supposed to be, now we can create a plan to do this. And very often we find the families at that place. But let me throw it back to you, Joanna. If there was this like, okay, how do we assess where we are? What would the questions be?
that the family should ask themselves as they’re either getting into the young adult or they’re already in the young adult and they’re starting to get that. Wait a minute. Something’s off here.
Joanna Lilley (13:54.828)
You
Joanna Lilley (14:06.07)
Yeah, I feel like this is one of those things that I’ve probably written an article on this exact topic before with here are the top 20 questions you need to be asking. So maybe I’ll revisit what articles I’ve written. But I think it really kind of falls under two categories. One, just doing that litmus test for the parent to identify what are they managing. And then,
providing space and an opportunity for the young adult. Like pass off what feels like is doable. So it could be something like have they scheduled their own appointments? Doesn’t matter what the appointment is. Can they schedule it? Can they follow through with set appointments? I think the same thing for medications. You know, do you know how to refill prescriptions? Pick them up. Do you know how to tell time? Do you know how to do your laundry? I mean, these are like
more like light independent-ish life skills, but there’s a litany of things that we can start to just identify. Does a young adult know how to boil water? Do they know how to check a, you know, what’s that? Why am I spacing on this? Like a carbon monoxide detector. Like if all of a sudden it’s beeping and you’re like, why is that thing beeping? Like, well, can I pull it down to see if the battery is like dying and replace the batteries? It’s things like that. They’re like,
that are going to make or break them living independently, but it certainly is gonna make it uncomfortable if they don’t know how to do that before they transition to wherever it is that they’re going. And then I think the other piece too is honestly just kind of doing a pulse check as well on who is helping the young adult and seeing is that a resource that will carry through moving forward? And most importantly, and I think this is a distinction of where we’re at.
and you kind of you started the conversation by saying parents were saying how do we get here? I didn’t think that I was going to still be like parenting at this point. So I think that there’s a prime opportunity. think young adults, every young adult needs a coach or a mentor because they need somebody that is peer-like but doesn’t have the emotional attachment to that comes with that shame, judgment, stigma, like everything that you’re talking about.
Joanna Lilley (16:22.572)
they need somebody that they can go to, but it doesn’t have to be mental health related, right? I don’t think we have to pathologize that every young adult absolutely needs a therapist. It’s just more like you just need somebody and you need somebody to be available to you to help you work through whatever it is that you’re stumbling and fumbling through, which is young adulthood. Because, there’s a lot less, again, there’s a lot less stigma that comes with somebody that is just objective in this process. I’m like, okay.
you somehow bleached all your clothes, let’s figure out what you did and let’s not do that again, right? Or like, I didn’t realize that you threw in the entire cap to the actual laundry detergent. Have you always done that? I’m curious where you learned that from. Like again, no judgment, just we’re teaching these skills, but in a safe space for the young adult to learn them and continue to kind of become their own interdependent adult. So I think that that’s…
That’s beneficial and that can start as early as 17. And I mean, we’re talking into our thirties. You need to have somebody that doesn’t have that attachment, but also is invested in the young person.
Robert Trout (17:29.876)
Yes, I agree completely. And I’ll step right in on that, that when we start talking about solution oriented practices, at least in our organization, this conversation starts for teenagers. It’s the, OK, yes, I know they’re being a teenager. I know that’s driving you nuts. They still need to learn to do their own laundry. They still need to learn to maybe drive or balance a budget or understand
the basics of what they’re going to need. And very often that metaphor always comes back to, OK, when you have a teenager, you are not the parent, you’re the coach, you’re the teacher. And your job is to focus on the like, yeah, for most of your life I did your laundry for you. Well, guess what? It’s time for you to take that off of my plate onto your plate so I can find all the mistakes you’re going to find.
Right? Home is the safe place to make those mistakes and they become jokes that you tell at Thanksgiving for the rest of your life because of the things that they did. And that’s the good thing to be able to do. Now, sometimes in scenarios, either developmentally or just family culture, or to be honest, we run into it sometimes where families just don’t think about it. They just don’t think about it. know, mom does the laundry and she’s just used to it and that’s just what she does.
And she never thought about it ever that the kid needed to be able to do it. And very often there’s even an assumption like, I’m sure they figured it out along the way. But there was never a teaching moment. So very often it’s like, OK, if you’re listening to this as a parent and you have a teenager, please take this to heart. This young adult conversation is really about you. You have teenagers and you’re getting them to that place. But.
Joanna Lilley (19:03.947)
Hmm.
Joanna Lilley (19:10.807)
Right.
Robert Trout (19:25.942)
taking that into, okay, this young adult left, and I started this by saying like, what we’re gonna try to get to are like the red flags that parents start to see. And this might be a good segue into it because there is that moment where as a parent and your child has left home, whatever scenario, school, trade, work, apartment, whatever it might be, there’s always that, okay, we’re checking in.
Joanna Lilley (19:34.241)
Hmm.
Robert Trout (19:54.536)
and hearing their stories. And I always recommend that parents focus on that, like an adult to adult relationship is going to coffee and letting them tell you the stupid thing they did and you not freaking out. Instead, log that, there’s something missing. I might need to step back in as mentor or teacher to help you with this. And that’s OK to do. But then I’m backing back out.
Sometimes the trap is my god, you can’t take care of yourself I’m gonna come in and do it all and now we’re in rescuer mode and that’s gonna create its own whole list of problems but let’s let’s see if we can come up with some of the basic red flags that parents should Look for in communication or lack of communication from young adults who are trying to individuate What’s the first that comes to you?
Joanna Lilley (20:27.114)
Hmm.
Joanna Lilley (20:49.408)
I think actually the very first thing is communication. So you just said it. Is all of a sudden the communication pattern changed drastically? Like either they’re blowing you up every five minutes, every 15 minutes, you know, like panicked. And whereas it used to be a little bit more.
you know, of a quote unquote normal cadence of like, maybe I’ll text you once a day or maybe I’ll talk to you every couple of days or maybe we schedule once a week where we actually do a FaceTime. Great. And all of a sudden it’s just like ramped up or the exact opposite where it’s completely dropped off. Parents are reaching out. They’re not getting any response at all from their young adult. That is a major red flag.
Robert Trout (21:33.79)
Absolutely. Yeah, whether it be isolation or just a sense of anxiety that’s preventing them from engaging in any way. Absolutely. I’m right there with you. Communication is usually the first like, huh, that’s weird. They didn’t show up for this call. So that’s a big one. Another red flag very often for us is where the parents start to recognize in the pattern that it’s the same conversation.
Joanna Lilley (21:49.602)
Yeah.
Robert Trout (22:02.864)
over and over again. There’s no variety. Which for us always comes down, not always, but like usually comes down into two main categories. One is that the person is using a smoke screen. If I say this to you, you’ll leave me alone. So it’s this like they’re panicking something’s wrong. They’re failing classes or whatever it might be.
But on the phone, it’s the same language, same story over and over again. So we call that the smoke screen, and that’s a red flag. Like, you need to get deeper into the conversation with them and see what happens. Because very often, if you just push a little bit, the young adult starts to cry with the parent. And it’s like, OK, we’re getting to the emotion. There’s something happening. Here we go. The second category that it usually falls in is, I’m going say it,
Joanna Lilley (22:36.608)
Hmm.
Joanna Lilley (22:47.084)
Yeah.
Robert Trout (22:58.304)
We have so many families that the red flag is like all he ever wants to talk about is getting a girlfriend and that’s it. The only conversation we can have is about that and that’s a red flag whether and that’s just one scenario but it’s like they talk about gaming they talk about this girl they talk about you know the class or the teacher what it like there’s an obsession focus that comes in and that is a red flag because usually that’s correlated to some.
Joanna Lilley (23:12.844)
Mm-hmm.
Joanna Lilley (23:20.918)
Hmm.
Robert Trout (23:26.206)
emotional effect that’s happening for them that they’re seeking a coping mechanism. And that turns into obsession that the parents do recognize after a while. But I always recommend like pay attention. Like I even have some parents that keep a notebook. We talked about this and we’re, you know, et cetera. And it’s like after five times of having a 30 minute conversation and it was only about this emotional distress because of relationship or whatever.
Joanna Lilley (23:55.628)
Mm-hmm.
Robert Trout (23:56.106)
That’s a red flag. There’s something happening. We’re seeing some decomposition happening.
Joanna Lilley (24:02.624)
Yeah, I like that. I’m just thinking through kind of the, as you were talking, I’m kind of processing through the cognitive distortions of this emerging adult population. And especially if it’s, I find it in kind of the transition points. So like the first semester college student who just graduated from high school that was like overly supported in high school has some pretty magical thinking around
Robert Trout (24:12.747)
Yeah.
Joanna Lilley (24:31.2)
you know, like, I’ll be able to turn in my work towards the end of the semester. And it’s like, but if you look at the syllabus, you’ve already failed the class and we’re not even at November 1st. And so when parents are kind of navigating this, providing a little bit of space so the young adult can learn that becomes a pretty like an impactful natural consequence because they are failing a class that they cannot get out of or can’t salvage. And sometimes those dots just
aren’t connected and towards the end of the semester. But what I was thinking about as you were talking about that is what is it that parents are hearing? I’m fine. I’m fine. My classes are fine, right? So it’s like, read the room, guys. If anybody says fine, it’s a mask for like, it’s about to go down. That’s what’s about to happen. So yeah, I like how you’re encouraging families to write notes or like take notes about what it is that their young adult is saying because sometimes it’s easy for us to be really avoidant.
Robert Trout (25:07.542)
Yeah.
Robert Trout (25:14.358)
Hahaha.
Joanna Lilley (25:28.524)
when we’re masking the depth of what’s really going on, or like you said, being hyper-focused or kind of obsessed about something that feels a little bit alarming to a parent. So ready for more red flags? Because here are some other ones. I’m curious what you think too. If some of your basic needs are out of whack, so if your sleep schedule, like somebody is sleeping and…
Robert Trout (25:40.257)
Yep.
Yes.
Joanna Lilley (25:53.77)
an excessive, what feels excessive amount of sleep or on the flip side of it, they’re not sleeping at all. Major red flags. Another thing too is eating. All of a sudden now, are we like overeating, overcompensating or are we just avoiding food altogether? Again, like pretty substantial. Like those are red flags to me because that’s going to impact their ability cognitively to function as a human.
So doesn’t matter if they’re a college student, it doesn’t matter if they’re an employee of some job because they’ve managed to either graduate college and then they’re in the work world or they never went to school. If you’re not eating or if you’re not sleeping, it’s only a matter of time before this becomes like a major issue.
Robert Trout (26:40.445)
Yes. Before we move on from that, also as a red flag, we find a significant correlation between parents recognizing something going on with eating patterns and eating disorders, where it’s like, you haven’t used your grocery budget this month. And some parents are like, great, they ate less. And it’s like,
Hold on a second, you know, if their food intake that you can see on their credit card that you’re helping pay for or that you give them a monthly allowance or whatever it might be, you start to recognize like, hey, wait a minute, something’s really going on here. A lot of parents that they do recognize the red flag the other direction where it’s like, what do you mean you’re out of money? It’s only two weeks into the month. And they’re like, I just, I’m eating like they’re.
Joanna Lilley (27:28.844)
Mm-hmm.
Robert Trout (27:36.894)
eating and eating and eating, stress eating or whatever it might be, parents get that one. The other direction is the one where it’s like, hold on a second, you’re not using the financial means that you have that would be normal for one person to use. And especially if they’re being social or something like that, because if they’re isolating and eating or isolating and not eating, you see that in the budget. So one of the red flags is recognizing if you’re
Joanna Lilley (27:38.903)
Mm-hmm.
Joanna Lilley (28:01.878)
Mm-hmm.
Robert Trout (28:04.69)
involved in the budget, it’s a great tracking meter of change that’s happening in their behavior and eating patterns.
Joanna Lilley (28:13.194)
Yeah, and I think just from like, generally speaking, what I see, and this is obviously anecdotal to me and the young adults that I work with, but I imagine it is, it probably resonates with a lot of other consultants. Oftentimes when we see such a swing in those eating patterns, it’s usually tied to anxiety, depression, or recent trauma.
And so when we’re thinking about that, that’s where like obviously the outward signs are noticeable to us, but we have to actually do a little bit more of a deeper dive into figuring out what’s at the core of this significant change. And the same thing happens going back with sleep, right? Like there’s something going on that’s significantly impacting your ability to rest your mind and your body. I think the other like biggest red flag for me, which I think we can…
Robert Trout (28:53.921)
Yes.
Joanna Lilley (29:05.472)
We can assume that this is a red flag, but I’m just gonna say it because it needs to be said. If all of a sudden your child, and I say child because this is your child no matter their age, if they are expressing any type of suicide ideation and that’s new to you, or it’s not new necessarily, but it’s increased in frequency or the way in which it’s communicated, always take that seriously.
This is the most impulsive developmental age group that makes decisions that have lasting consequences that cannot be undone, especially when it comes to suicide. And so I can’t emphasize that enough to a parent. If you are remotely worried about your child, please do not wait and hope that this will pass because it may not.
Robert Trout (30:01.92)
Yep. And it is one of those things like you can pay attention to behavioral changes as well. So for example, families that the kid will come home from college or just come over to visit for a holiday or whatever it might be. And some parents that will recognize that now they only wear long sleeves, for example, which was not normal before.
It’s like, okay, that is a behavioral change. And it brings up that like, okay, maybe they’re cutting. Maybe they’ve got something going on physically, they’re trying to hide from you or whatever it might be. And to be clear, a certain level of hiding who they are is normal. That’s individuating, et cetera. They got a tattoo and they don’t want you to know. But when you see, okay, their mood is also really low.
And this behavioral change, like you start putting the pieces together. It’s like, maybe I need to engage on a relational level. And I say that very specifically, because if we start talking solution oriented practices, there’s so much parents need to learn about how to engage, right? To be helpful and therapeutic in their approach to understanding the mental health, developmental health, behavioral health processes that are happening.
Joanna Lilley (31:01.986)
Mm-hmm.
Robert Trout (31:27.094)
So with that caveat, it’s recognizing the red flag of the behavioral change because sometimes they don’t say, I, you know, I want to die or hurt myself or I’m suicidal or et cetera. And very often they don’t. So it’s the recognizing like, your clothes are different. You’re dressing differently. You’re acting differently. Your mood is dramatically shifted. Now that’s the opening that I can therapeutically explore. Who are you now?
It doesn’t mean there’s a problem, but we definitely recommend the awareness goes up as the parents saying they’re either becoming more of who they think they are or there’s something developing that they might not want us to know because so much about parents is like the kids want you to be proud of them. So they they automatically hide and that’s normal. That’s not even one of the symptoms. It’s just like, okay.
Joanna Lilley (32:16.811)
Mm-hmm.
Robert Trout (32:24.406)
We have to work our way through them becoming who they are as a young adult to build a new relationship with.
Joanna Lilley (32:32.48)
Yeah, I like that. mean, I think what we’ve we’ve talked mostly about is identity.
Right? The other piece that we’re talking about is independence. And I think the third piece that’s also another I that is kind of characteristic of young adults is intimacy. And we haven’t really talked about that too much other than maybe the example that you’re talking about, maybe like that young person that was obsessed with this. I just, I’m wanting this girlfriend. Right? So I think what is normal rejection, but how you handle rejection. and we’re not just talking about sexual relationships. I’m just talking about friendships, right?
Robert Trout (32:40.716)
Mm-hmm.
Robert Trout (33:09.27)
Yes.
Joanna Lilley (33:09.698)
co-workers, relationships with professors, or anybody, especially if you’re doing things that strike your fancy, like you like to ride horses, are you connected with the people at this barn, right? You want to play video games? Did you find people locally that like to code and play video games? know, like, that is a big part of kind of that, again, this developmental period for young adults emerging.
outside of the home or away from parents, right, as we call it, individuation. But a part of that too is what relationships are you establishing? So I think that that’s also like, you see people that are having their, you know, first, they’re heartbroken for the first time or they’re struggling to connect with people. But I think all of that is then tied to those red flags we just talked about, right? If they’re struggling to make these connections in relationship.
and now it’s impacting their, you know, they’re stressing out about whether or not they want to be in the world, they’re self-harming, they’re not eating, they’re not sleeping, then that is where it’s taken a different turn, where it’s moved from what is normal to a maladaptive coping.
Robert Trout (34:25.888)
Yes, absolutely.
Well, I’m going to say that the last one for me that comes up as a red flag for parents to, I guess, recognize or, and you know, it’s scary sometimes having these conversations because it’s like, I don’t want you to panic and go like nitpick and like look under a microscope. What’s going on for my kid? The truth is, is a lot of people do just fine. What we’re talking about is the just staying aware of what’s happening. So I do want to put that caveat out there.
to the conversation, to any parent that’s listening. And the final kind of red flag I can think of in this conversation that comes up a lot is the idea where the kid, there’s a sense of rebellion that they start to try to make you the enemy. Okay? It is normal to individuate.
Joanna Lilley (35:23.138)
Mm.
Robert Trout (35:27.144)
It is normal to become their selves and especially if they go off to a whole new community and they’re making friends and they’re social and they’re trying on who they might become, right? They’re just trying on these different skins and personalities and language and skills and whatever it might be. That’s all normal. But there is a red flag that we find a lot where the kid will then turn around and try to make you go away.
And that can happen for a lot of different reasons. So this is a red flag and the caveat. This might be okay. And the question is, just why are they pushing us away? Why have we become the enemy to their like setup of who they are? And sometimes that’s a budding like emotional personality disorder process. Like there’s something starting to happen.
And sometimes it’s just normal. So I say this and I hope everyone’s hearing this. I’m being very careful. This can be absolutely normal and OK because as they develop and they get towards that 25, 26, 27, the prefrontal cortex finished develop, very often we’ll see that individual turn back around and say thank you so much for what you did for me in my life. Right, so please hear that there’s that. But there is a curiosity that we we would recommend parents look at.
Joanna Lilley (36:49.238)
Mm-hmm.
Robert Trout (36:56.798)
If they’re pushing you away, it is a good question why. What’s going on there? And just to be aware of it and hold space for it, but pay attention to what might be coming up. That’s the last one I can really think of. What about you, Joanna? You got any other little bits that we’d recommend parents look for?
Joanna Lilley (37:16.78)
think you did kind of hit on it earlier, but I want to expand on it. think it’s just more of a like whoever they were before, if all of a sudden they have completely lost interest in a lot of those things. So when I think of like a prime example is like the…
three sport athlete that was like the star, you know, in high school. And then they go off to college and they don’t do anything. I’m not saying like collegiate athletics. I’m saying they don’t even, they don’t do intramurals. They don’t do club sports. They don’t go to the gym. They’re doing nothing active. And that was a big part of who they were, what kept them, kept them balanced. And now all of a sudden what I often see, and I’m sure a lot of other people do too, is
Now all of a sudden they’re just smoking weed all the time. So it’s such a swing and difference. And again, this is like, okay, is it normal? But my question is, have they completely moved away from what made them the happiest that was, again, not just physically, but socially and emotionally that was like their thing. Now all of a sudden we’re not doing that at all. Like what happens then, right? I think that
Robert Trout (38:01.824)
Yeah.
Joanna Lilley (38:27.722)
And a part of that is not just, you know, what are you passionate about or some of the activities that you really liked, but it’s just filling your time doing things. I think that’s also to me a giant red flag. If I have the like valedictorian from high school that’s going off to college and all they say is I’m not going to get connected to anything other than paying attention to academics. Well, academics is only going to take up maybe 40, 50 hours of your week if you’re like
studying kind of obsessively. There’s a lot more time left in the day and the week for them to be doing something. So to be doing nothing is, is I would almost call it like an orange flag. Maybe it’s not a red flag. It’s an orange flag. There is a need for them to be connected outside of academics or work, right? If we want to use that as an example, like you got it, you got to do something. You got to be connected to someone. Cause really what ends up happening is the isolation.
or the lack of connection can lead to more problems down the line. So just think about that. We can call it being connected to extracurriculars or just like some sort of social activities, but it’s also a part of what was so ingrained for them for so long that this transition provided the space for a complete drop off in whatever it was that they were doing.
Robert Trout (39:52.822)
So I guess to close this conversation out for any parent that’s listening, these are the most common red flags we as professionals run into that we hear from the families that have found themselves at a level of struggle that they already know they need support. So this is a little bit to help you like, okay, what should I be doing? What should I be looking for? And this may not prevent a crisis or a mental health process or et cetera.
But your awareness and early intervention is usually one of the most helpful things to provide a positive outcome. So we hope you take this and kind of break it apart for yourself as individuals and families and parents to figure out like, okay, maybe that thing I’m seeing is something I should explore and ask questions about and build communication and relationship with my young adult so that I remain safe and connected and apart.
of the process no matter what is happening for them. As always, we want to thank you for listening. And Joanna, thank you for being our guest today. And I’m sure we’ll see you on here again. And to all the parents out there, please find us at parenttrainers.com to look into joining our community of families and professionals that are interacting and working together for solutions. And we hope to find you there. Thank you.
